Aptera Bodies?

[Pipercub]

Chris is absolutely right in the aspect of the legality's of putting out a DYI kit, so my question would be is that a #1 patent issue # 2 IP rights issue or liability issues ? And these are questions concerning the type 1 or 2.

Input please....

[TruthSeeker]

Originally Posted by Pipercub

Input please....

What you are trying to do in a nutshell is to find a way to get Aptera Motors Inc. to start small and grow big like back in 2006? I am sure there are a few people out there that would buy Aptera Kits. Most people myself included do not know the first thing of building anything. I could help someone start a small business but that is it. There would not be enough people who have the time, money, patience and etc. to build a kit car. As I understand, there is a ton of work that goes into set up kit car kits. So not a lot of money would be made. The economy is horrible right now. A lot of people do not have jobs to pay for their living costs. But there is a silver lining in all of this. People still need to get to work, home and etc. People need a vehicle which will save them fuel and not cost a lot of money. I like the Aptera 2e. The Aptera 2e looks like a car the major automakers would build. I look at the first vehicle Chris and Steve ever build together called the Aptera Mk-o/Typ-1. The Aptera Mk-o/Typ-1 looks like a College Team Solar Car. I think building the Aptera Mk-o/Typ-1 would cost a lot less money than building the Aptera 2e. Would it be possible to build the Aptera Mk-o/Typ-1 one at a time to raise much needed cash? That way, people could start to drive their car as soon as they get it rather than having to spend a few weeks to months building it. Let's say Chris and Steve do not win the auction, they could named the car company something different and make a few minor changes to the design of the vehicle to not break the law on IP Rights of the new Aptera IP Owner. I think either Steve and Chris will either win or lose at the auction. But they can still build the Aptera under a different name if needed. I see them moving back to where they first left off back in 2006. Start small means having to spend less money to stay afloat for a longer period of time. When more people want to buy an Aptera, they can move to a grocery store that is now close. The landlords make some extra money and Steve and Chris have a large place to work at. There are a lot of close stores because of the 2008 Market Crash. Buy some tools from some auctions, hardware stores and etc. They could even get the customer to help build his/her own Aptera to feel connection. I hope you enjoy the reading. I look forward to your responses.

[dfbvt]

Pipercub

Chris is absolutely right in the aspect of the legality's of putting out a DYI kit, so my question would be is that a #1 patent issue # 2 IP rights issue or liability issues ? And these are questions concerning the type 1 or 2.

Input please...

.

Well, for starters on your #1 question, there are no patents on the PP series. However there is a "Design" patent on the FatSo-1. Contrary to what you might think, a "design” patent has nothing to do with the "nuts & bolts" of how the patented device works. A design patent only patents the "looks" of something as in artistic form. There are no “intellectual property” patents released on the SO-1. I have a copy of the Design Patent on the SO-1 which was initiated by Jason Hill and assigned to you know who. It is exactly what the SO-1 looks like.

So one could legally build a production car or a Kit car based on the PP series and "legally" get away with it. However, in the real world... well, I have a saying about patents “A patent is only as good as the amount of money the Patentee has to defend his Patent”. I have 2 Patents and could easily have had several more but I didn't bother due to this statement. I have a couple of business friends that went through 2 year bloody legal battles. One kept part of his company and the other works for someone else. Oh, and the patent is only good in the US. If you want to patent your device over seas guess what? Yep. More money to Patents attorneys in each country in the world. Oh, and there about 192 +/- countries in the world.

If the 3 wheel Aptera ends up in the hands of a cooperative owner and they build on the SO-1 chases (minus a lot of weight) then it might be possible to work a deal where molds might be pulled from, say the PP-6.5 (everyones favorite from a aesthetic point of view) and all else is built with different motors/ Inverters, batteries ETC, then the deep pocket lawsuit target (Aptera) might be able to defend them selves w/o to much trouble. And it would behoove the Kit builder to have at least $1m product liability to boot. I currently carry $2m Product Liability for my 3 company's and it does cost a dollar-295.

So I hope this answers you 3 questions Don, Its not real encouraging but I'm keeping at it just in case these problems can be over come. You never know until the cows come home (yeah - I live in Vermont)

Cheers,

Dave Bowles

[Pipercub]

@ Truthseeker,
I really have a hard time seeing the Aptera vehicle mass produced since it really is a niche vehicle which was really designed to be an " go from point A to point B " mode of transportation,. I can't see a large part of our society wanting to scale down to a vehicle like this. I've read here that Aptera would build 1000 to 10,000 units a year, at the time of the article I could see that, but this is 4 years since. The ones left here at this site can see the advantages of a vehicle like this but you can't force those thoughts on others...I really do see this as a kit vehicle or a low production vehicle.
I spent four years restoring my airplane, it's a hell of a lot of research for components, and finding the right vendors and talents in others to help you realize you dream.
If this was a kit car where you could purchase just the composite components ie; body, doors rear wheel skirt and wheel pants you would still be looking at a 12 to 18 month process to fabricate the other parts to do it right and thats on the optimistic side of the time table, plus you need everything to go along with that, as far as space and the "right tools".
Realistically, it's a very expensive project just as an airplane is to build, it becomes your life for the build time, all your disposable money and time must be dedicated to realize your vision or like so many car and airplane projects that are started, most are sitting in a barn or garage somewhere sad and unfinished rotting away.
It all comes down to money and time and having personal realistic dreams. Someone told me once after I finished the restoration of my airplane of how proud I must be, only a very small fraction of kits or restorations are ever completed, it does make you feel good especially after all of the scares of the build are healed with congratulations from your peers of a job well done !
I have the desire to tackle another project, I would like this to be it, so I shall wait and see what happens with the sale of the hard assets, time will tell !

[TruthSeeker]

Originally Posted by Pipercub

@ Truthseeker,

First, I would like to thank you for your quick response. I think Aptera is like the cell phone or the personal computer 20 years oago. Back in the day, everyone though that the cell phone was used by only rich business men. Than the cell phone became cheaper and a higher quality. It took over 20 years for the cell phone to become a major part in our society. I think it will take a couple of years at least before the Aptera got a world following like the Starbucks Brand or the cell phone did. Chris and Steve will have to start out small when they try to restart Aptera. Maybe, at a close up grocery store to be used as a startup factory. I like your idea of Aptera being a kit car. People will like their car better if they play a part in building it than just buying it at the local car dealership. I would love to build my own car but I do not know the first thing about building a car even from a kit. Maybe Aptera could have a deal at Aptera factory where the customer can come to help build his/her car. That way, the person feels happy he/she build his/her own car and the Aptera will be safe to drive when finish. If I am in Florida, I would love to fly in your airplane you build.